#43 Value Add Construction with Gabe Dasilva
Gabe Dasilva’s got something unique we haven’t talked about in any of our podcasts, and there aren’t too many people that I know that do what he does. He has been coined “Mr. Add-A-Level” for his extensive knowledge of construction heavy renovations. He specializes in implementing effective profitability optimization strategies & systems and conducting complex financial valuations and analyses.
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Welcome to another fantastic episode of real estate masters. I’m Tony Javier, your host as usual. And today we have Gabe DaSilva out of New Jersey. Um, he’s got something unique we haven’t really talked about in any of our podcasts and there’s not too many people that I know that does what he does. And that’s a lot of value add, um, uh, I can’t remember exactly what he called it and we’ll jump into- Value by Construction – I think is what he called it. So, um, I do a lot of fix and flips, a lot of other, uh, investors add value to the properties, but he does it in a very unique way. So Gabe, what’s going on, dude. It’s good to connect with you. We just met too, not too long ago, man, but we’ve had a lot of synergy. We communicated a lot recently and I’m glad we can get on and chat in front of everybody and add some value.
Yeah, absolutely man. Thank you for having me on. I’m excited. Uh, like you said, a lot of synergies, we’re wired a lot of like, uh, I want to bring value, so I’m excited to be here for your audience, share my kind of journey and what we do and why I believe there’s opportunities for everybody to do it.
Yeah. Yeah. There’s so much opportunity in real estate. That’s why it’s so great. I mean, you can wholesale, you can fix and flip. You can, we’re going to talk about it, a strategy that you use and not a lot of people are doing. There’s so many opportunities in real estate. So let’s start with the beginning. Let’s start. Let’s talk about how you started, got into it. People love to hear about that side of it because we have experienced investors on here. We have new investors. So tell us about your journey where you started. And man, he told me how long you’ve been in the business and just in the last six years, it seems like you really learned a lot and scaled a lot and really built a great business. So I’ll let you take it, man.
Yes. My origin story, not unlike a lot of other peoples, uh, I was in the nine to five grind. Uh, absolutely hated it. I was working the cube farm, uh, stifled in this little box with my gray garbage can and my gray computer and my gray freaking carpet and right. So no opportunity to grow, to create, to do anything of any real, um, significant value there. And, uh, I found my way into entrepreneurship, uh, via an introduction from a friend who was equally miserable at his nine to five. We sought out to create a restaurant concept. So my first foray into entrepreneurship was in the food service space, which is why I’m such a processes and systems guy, because you have to be in that space because, uh, inventory has a really short shelf life. So food turns real quick. So you learn very, very quickly how to be processed and systems oriented.
And so my first foray into entrepreneurship was that that was a four year run. I ultimately sold the restaurant to my partner and then transitioned into real estate, uh, where I brought a lot of those, um, those methods, those processes, those systems, just the way you run a restaurant. I brought that to what I believed was a, um, an industry that really lacks systemization. Uh, you have a lot of contractors shooting from the hip running rehabs, uh, off a clipboard in the back of their pickup truck. And so I just came into the business and said, let me do what I did in food in real estate and see how it serves me. And it has served me really well. It was, um, especially powerful because we, uh, I guess we’re going to get into this, but we chose a niche that a lot of people weren’t operating in at the time. And, uh, we are real systematic about how we, uh, exploited that niche. And, uh, that’s been our, um, that’s been our claim to fame. We’ll call it
Awesome, man. So you’re in New Jersey, you do a lot of value at construction. Um, so not a lot of people do that. It’s, you know, it’s definitely more time consuming. The great thing about what you’re doing now, and you can tell me if I’m wrong, but like when people wholesale, it’s like, you know, pretty quick transaction, right? It’s quick money, which is great. For me, I love fixing and flipping because we can spend an extra 30, 45 days adding a ton of valuable property and make a lot more than we can full salmon. But today’s market is so crazy right now that I bet you, the deals you’re buying, uh, you know, now, or deals you bought, let’s say three or four months ago that you’re now putting on the market are probably worth more than you thought they would be worth three to four months ago. So that may not last forever, but that’s probably a great thing about what you’re doing is there may be another 20, $30,000 in appreciation over, you know, three to four months just because the market’s so great. And so talk a little bit about that. So talk about your value add, why you do that. I know you have a program where you teach that and that kind of stuff. So I’d like to kind of hear how you found that that did and, um, just kind of ins and out of it.
Yeah. So that how I found that method, it’s a great way to kind of weave back into and finish the whole origin story piece because who steps into a value add rehab on their first one? Not many people, right? Cause it’s the construction piece is, um, it’s scary, right? It’s, it’s kind of burdensome and people look at it and they get overwhelmed. What ultimately happened was I got in over my head on my first rehab, brought a bunch of day labor in. They started demoing the house. I was leaving, running to the town to get permits and all other sorts of things in order. And I would come back each day and these guys would have demoed another wall, another room like the intention was to do a cosmetic rehab, a kitchen, two bathrooms, a refinish the floors, some paint. And over the course of a couple of days, they started tearing down another wall. Another wall before I knew it a week later, they had essentially gut demo the house. So what was supposed to be a cosmetic rehab, turned into a full gut rehab real fast.
I accidentally did that and they were just tearing out walls and didn’t realize they were tearing out the wrong stuff?
This is why at the time, I didn’t know any better. I’m picking up daily labor in front of the Home Depot, right? The things I absolutely tell my students to never ever do now. Uh, that’s what I was doing. And those guys were like half in the bag. They were likely drinking while they were there because I was leaving them and I was going to run other things and whatever I was doing, I would come back each day and I was like, like they did that. They did that. They did that by the time a week was done. And I had a Saturday to myself on site. I just walked in. I was actually in tears looking around like, what the hell did I get in? What did I get myself into? The whole house was gutted, right? At that point it was the point of no return.
Um, and that was my fault. I didn’t manage them properly. I didn’t know what I was doing. Um, and they just swung hammers. That’s what I was bringing them there to do. So, um, I, and here’s the beauty in this, right? This was a gift. I ultimately did a full gut reno. The cosmetic rental on that property would have worked. There was money to be made there, but one thing you can’t duplicate is location. This house happened to be in a little enclave in a desirable town, the most desirable enclave in that town. And so by virtue of the fact that it was where it was, it really did warrant the gut rehab that I wasn’t going to do. So I got lucky, uh, in doing that gut rehab, we go on to make 82,000 on our very first deal and that the bug bit me and I said, wait a second, like if I can do this and I didn’t even mean to how much more of this opportunity is out there. And so that’s why, and we’ve never looked back, we’ve done some cosmetic rehabs here and there we’ve wholesaled. We’ve done some of the other stuff, but we stay true to a bigger value add, add a levels, pop, tops, whatever you want to call them additions. And, um, and even new constructions now.
That’s amazing. That’s interesting. Cause we are talking about this in many other podcasts in that, you know, when, when stuff doesn’t go, right, there’s typically, you know, the same, there’s a silver lining that another one door closes another one. I mean, there’s so many different sayings to it, but in real estate. And like you really get to learn that because there’s so many moving parts and so many things that go wrong, but you were able to find something that added value to your business in the very beginning. And now is something that has brought a lot of good too. So, um, just something I’d like to talk about because it means that, you know, it real estate instead doesn’t go right. Deals fall apart. In fact, it’s interesting. One thing that happened last year, I had a deal that, um, we’re supposed to close quickly in December of last year and it kept getting pushed back, kept getting pushed back and I was wanting it to close cause it had a bunch of money tied up into, so we’re going to make a lot of money on it.
Well, it gets pushed back into like February of this year. So like three months, um, I was, I wasn’t pissed, but I was like, man, you know, we could use that money and put it into the other stuff. And like I just ate money sitting there, it’s coming back. And so we went that our PPP PPP loan, you know, our second round of PPP and had we closed on that property, our revenue would have exceeded based on their previous year to, to not get. So we got a ton of money from PPP and had that deal closed in December and we wouldn’t have got that. So anyway, just a weird story. I thought I’d share that, you know, stuff wasn’t going right at the time, but you know, now it’s like when deals don’t close on time, I just let it ride. It’s not a big deal anymore.
So, but cool man. So tell us, um, tell us about the labor part of it. So people love wholesaling because it’s easy and quick, uh, for someone to go and do an addition to do a pop top, that kind of thing. It’s going to be scary to them. I have only done in 20 years. I can say I’ve, I’ve done one pop top where I had a second level. For those of you who don’t understand that term. And then I’ve maybe done one other addition that I, if I did, I can’t even remember. So I really only done one. I think of what you’re talking about. So if someone’s getting into the business, would you recommend that they do it on their first deal? Or do you recommend them doing other things before they do a pop tops or additions?
So here’s what I advise it’s so there’s two components and the reason that they’re there, wasn’t, there’s more competition now than there was then is, uh, you likely don’t have both very, it’s like the, the, the wherewithal to understand and do the construction piece. Usually you’ve got GCs that get that, but they’re not finance guys. Then you’ve got investors that understand complex financial structures and raise money, but they’re overwhelmed when they look at the construction. So what I advise is that those two people align, um, right. So if you guys are in the business and you can raise money, uh, and you see an opportunity to do this type of deal, but you’re put off by the extent of the rehab, the construction, the budget on the scope, uh, align with someone in a JV capacity who has done projects of that size and scale, uh, or, um, or find someone in your local market.
That’s a GC that hasn’t necessarily, uh, dipped his toe into the investment waters yet, but is willing. And I do structures like this. This is why I can speak to this. Like my framer and I have done a deal together. That’s someone who understands construction at the level you might not, and can run that project efficiently and effectively. And then you can find the deal. You can fund the deal, he can fix the deal and then together, you guys can flip it. In-house, an agent, whatever. So I always look at it like the four F’s – find, fund, fix, flip. The fix and the fund, those two F’s are the ones that make these pop top style, um, value add rehabs. So overwhelming. And they really aren’t. It’s just about aligning with the right people.
Yeah, no, I like that. I like that. There’s um, there’s a book called, “Who, Not the How”, I’m sure you’ve probably heard of that by Dan Solomon just came out recently and the concept is don’t figure out how to do it, figure out who can do it. Right. So, um, so I like that concept. In fact, I was on a mastermind call. I was kind of telling you about earlier today. And it was interesting because a lot of people were asking questions of, you know, how do you do this? How do you do that? And then one guy came on and he’s one of those guys. He lives, uh, he lives in a, uh, exotic location and he runs a lot of different businesses, but he, I, he works a lot, but he doesn’t work a lot. If that makes sense. You know what I’m saying in his question was who can help me do this?
Who can, and he was just like looking for referrals for like, who could do the things for him rather than us, rather than him trying to figure things out. So I think that’s something that not a lot of people do. And it took me a long time to figure that out. But man, if you want to, you and I were talking about this before we started, like who can run Facebook ads who can build a funnel for me, who can, can do all these things. So there were going into construction. It sounds like it’s the same thing. And that’s what you teach. So if someone’s done what you want to do and finding some of the plugins, so it sounds like, uh, the best play. So, um, so from a standpoint of, you know, there’s a lot of moving parts to it. There’s, you know, there’s permitting, there’s blueprints you have to do.
I mean, there’s architects, you know, in most cities and states in, you know, in Wichita, we did an addition. I don’t know that you have to have architectural drawings. I could be wrong. Cause again, I, I have never dealt with Wichita, but, uh, I know there are a lot of places that do require that. So tell me about your system. Like obviously you refined the system, you’re finding your processes. You have a lot of students in your program that you’re, that are having success in doing it. Um, so tell us about like from A to Z the system kind of in a nutshell on how you put that, put that all together.
Yeah. So it, so it evolved over time. As I step into it, I have that mindset that comes from the restaurant space, which is you gotta be systematic. You have to have processes. Uh, but I don’t know what they are. They evolve over time. I just try and create the most robust right? Systems really are just fancy words for lists. All systems start out as lists. So I start listing steps. And over the course of the first couple of projects, you start to see the same steps taking place in the same order. Uh, ultimately that thing gets beefed out to 60 steps. So we have our rehab milestone template. It’s 60 steps. It has the order of operations, what trades come in and what order, if you follow this milestone template, uh, you execute to this template, you get it done in the order it’s supposed to get done.
So that’s how we keep our rehabs on track. Even us having done dozens and dozens of these at this point, we’ll still work to these milestone templates. They are the beating heart of our business, our project manager, when he reports in on his KPIs, on his scorecard every Monday, right over the whiteboard where all this happens are our trade tracker and our rehab milestone template. Those are the two – that’s the lifeblood of our operations division. And so we manage to those, um, systems, which is really just a fancy word for lists. And that’s exactly what I encourage my students to do. I encourage anybody who’s going to do this to work to that model, work to that system. Don’t even if you are going to JV or hire a GC to run point on your project, do not trust him to shoot from the hip. Insist that he worked to assist them. Um, because that’s why they’re there. That’s why checklists exist. That’s why, you know, pilots have a checklist every time that flight goes up, every time that plane takes off, they have to do the same things in the same order because there’s 200 of us in the back whose lives depend on it.
Have you watched the show Air Disasters before?
Oh no, dude.
It’s addicting. It’s all about plane crashes and why they happen and what you just said. Like literally they go through a checklist. If there’s one thing they missed, there’s a potential that planes going down. Right. It’s in the main thing is, and now there’s a system to planes like these days, like putting, I guess it, yeah. Put flaps a certain way and you take off, if you don’t put the flaps a certain way, you’re not, you’re going to get lift for a minute and then you’re just going to like nosedive. So anyway, it was just kind of interesting. I’m kind of addicted to that show. And my wife’s like, man, you’re watching that show again. Um, just because it’s like, one thing happens and like you have, like you said, you have a hundred and some people on a plane and like they’re there, their lives are in your, in your hands. And like, even like pilots will miss things on a checklist and totally throw their wealth. Um, the, uh, you know, the flight. And my camera went off, let me reload that. I got a setting in my camera. That shuts off 30 minutes. So I gotta, I gotta figure out how to change that. So talk, talk about checklists. I should’ve put that on the checklist before I started. Cause honestly, if I would have restarted the camera before we started, that wouldn’t happen.
I think the checklist thing like, Hey, when we think about the plane thing and like keeping the plane afloat, keeping the plane in the air, keeping the people alive, treat your rehab the same way, keep your rehab alive, keep your rehab afloat, move the thing forward per this checklist per this system, get it done. It’s not sexy. Like nobody’s over here doing cartwheels over checklists. But if you execute to the checklist and you get to the closing table and your net six figures, which you absolutely should on every one of these projects, that’s the other reason I advocate for them because the spreads are fat. Like then you could do your cartwheels, then you can be excited. So, I mean, I don’t want to overstate it, but like you and I were talking about before we hit record, like where systems processes, guys, we subscribed to EOS, to Gino Wickman, to traction, to that, like the entrepreneur operating system. I genuinely genuinely believe it’s the Business Bible. And it’s what I implement in my business now. And, and I will in indefinitely.
So tell me about the, you know, the things that you’ve learned since you started, like we talked about, there are so many things that can go wrong in the real estate game, but if they go right and you know, more things go right and wrong and you can make a lot of money. Right. So what are some things that you’ve learned lesson you learned that you can kind of give the listeners that are starting out their business or, or, you know, scaling the business separate. Hmm.
Uh, so for those that are scaling, uh, what I would say is you don’t have to do more of what you did to get where you are to get where you want to go. And a lot of times you feel like you do because it’s what you know. And so we really leveraged this niche, um, to the point where I had blinders on. And all I saw were dated capes, ranches, and bungalows that I could put another freaking box on top of everything looked like a national level and it was great. And it served us for a few years. Uh, it served us almost too well to the point where we were doing so many of them. We didn’t see anything else. We’re doing a lot of different things. Now we’ve taken that value, add approach to single family fix and flips, and we’ve transitioned it into commercial.
We’re repositioning a commercial asset, we’re bidding a 16 unit garden, apartment development. Like these are things that once you have get a handle on the construction elements, um, you can take that and apply it elsewhere. You can apply it to a different asset class. So I say that to say, like, if you’re trying to scale, you may have to start asking yourself different questions because it’s not just about doing more of what you’re doing now. Uh, that’s scaling in a linear fashion when the idea is to scale exponentially. So that’s what I would say is a big learning lesson for us that took me longer than it should have. Like I could cut a year and change off my, like my learning curve had I said, Hey, listen, we did four. Now we’re going to do eight. Now we’re going to do 12. Like that. Wasn’t that? Wasn’t the answer. The answer wasn’t to just keep doing more of the same thing it was to say, Hey, we got this figured out, this continues to run, but let’s see how we can take what we learned here and move it to the next level.
When you think about like, you know, your team, you know, how long did it take you to put your team together? Cause I imagine right now you’d come across a deal. You just throw your team on and I’m sure you have, like, I don’t know an architect and project manager and contractor. Um, you’ve got this team put together. So talk a little bit about that. How long did it take you to put that team together to be able to do these, uh, fairly efficient?
Yeah. So, uh, the team that we have now, I don’t, um, take for granted, right? I understand that this took a while to develop in someone earlier in their journey, won’t necessarily have all of these resources. What they will have is the ability to joint venture. The way we suggested earlier to create synergies with the people that are experts, the who, not the how thing again, like who is it that you can align with that knows how to draw these. That can be your resident architect, um, who can be your, uh, sales dispositions specialist. Like who can you align with in a true synergetic, like partnership style capacity. So for us, it was approaching and tradesmen. This is a really hard sell. Uh, it’s saying, Hey guys, we’re not going to be your one and done. We’re not going to be like the retail job that you do in the summer when everybody’s flushed and sitting home with the kids and saying, you know what?
We need to do the pool this year. We need to do the kitchen this year. We’re going to be the ones that keep you going through the winter. You’re going to want to align with us because we’re not doing this deal in that’s it, our intention is to do 12 of these next year. And that’s going to be how you keep your guys going. And that was really powerful for us. That’s how, and then we had to do it. We had to say it, but then we had to do it too. And so that, that’s how the team was built. That’s how the team’s evolved over time to the point now where, you know, the guys that I have have been with me for years and I can trust them to run point on my projects when I’m not there. And when my project, manager’s not there, like everyone’s an extension of our brand now when they’re on our jobs, but this takes time, you know, nobody’s going to just step into that, unless you JV with someone who’s already done this legwork.
Yeah. There’s no, nothing better than having a team that you know, and trust and have the confidence in. Cause now you find a deal, you know, that your team can, can do the deal and do it efficiently. And obviously there’s going to be kinks in it. There’s always going to be something, especially in big projects like that. But to be able to know that you can just plug and play, uh, is, is a huge benefit. And it does take time, you know, treat people right. Find the right people. And I have a 10% rule now. And you and I talked about hiring people to do like different ads and stuff like that. It’s like someone has to be, and it’s kind of hard to gauge the exact percentage of like what they are, but like someone needs to be at the top 10 percentile of what they do for me to hire them in anything. I am as an employee, having them as a, um, you know, as a Facebook ads guy, you know, that kind of thing. And once you get that high level of people, it’s like, you may pay them a little bit more, but they’re going to get stuff done. And you’re going to be able to accomplish a lot more, uh, with those kinds of kinds of people.
Yeah. I love the A-player model, right? Like A player’s role with A players and they only want to roll with A players. You put a C player in the mix, A players, they start to get anxious and Cs have the ability to drag down A’s. It’s, it’s just, it’s just something they can do with their energy. Whereas As, you can’t bring a C up to an, a level. Cause they’re just the C. Right. They’re just wired that way. So I find A players, I pay them the premium, like you’re talking about and I try and get them around other A-players. So together we’re the A-player team and that’s why we kick, but put a B, a C in the mix and see how fast that dynamic shifts. And so you, and that’s an IQ. People, people are inherently good at that. They don’t know that they’re good at that. But like, you’re born with that as a child, you know how to read people. It’s just over time, right? Like all the noise makes it challenging. But in the end, like, you know, your gut tells you like this guy, this guy is going to skate on me. I’m going to give him this deposit is going to show up for a week and then he’s gone. And then what happens a week later? He’s gone.
Yeah. I’ve been in the business 20 years now. It sounds like the first 10 years of my business, man. When you said, when you said day labor, I’m like, oh my gosh. I remember those days when I would just like, oh, you can swing a hammer, come on, let’s go.
We should go up. Their eyes are bloodshot red. They obviously been up all night. They stink like booze, but you forgive all that because you’re like, well, I need someone to demo this house.
If they show up. If, oh man, I, I anyway, I can tell story after story. But like, you know, there’s always an excuse and the best one is their wives call me. And by the way so-and-so got arrested, they’re probably not going to be for work for a few days. And I’m like, no, they’re not going to be at work in a few days. They’re not coming back. Like I actually, in the beginning I used to let them come back and I just don’t hire those kinds of people anymore. But even if it did happen right now, I’d be like, you just have to have a higher standard and you get a, once you have a higher standard, you get better results.
Yeah. And it’s worth it to pay. We’re talking about the who, not the, how pay the better who, like pay the better pay the A player more. And I don’t really beat my guys up. You know, a lot of people like investors, like the pound, their chest, it’s an ego thing and they want to get the best bid. Like I don’t want the best bid. I want the best work product. I want the best working relationship. So I gladly pay my guys, uh, more than most other investors would. And I compliment the end and I give them a piece of deals when deals go well, uh, I reward them because I’m doing really well. So I want them to share it in that. And that’s how you build an A-player team. That’s how you scale an operations division.
Yeah. Absolutely. Man. Well, let’s start wrapping up man. Anything else you want to share with the grip? You’ve done a lot in six years. I know you’ve got a coaching program and you teach this well. We’ll tell people how to find that here in just a minute. But any last words before we start wrapping this up?
Yeah. I would say, I mean like two things, uh, you know, take action and the power of your circle. Like you’re not an investor until you invest in a thing. And so if you’re newer in your journey and you’re watching this and you’re wondering like where you are, where you fit in, right? You fit in aligned with someone who’s already taking action. If you’re not the person to step out and take action on your own. Some people are true entrepreneurs. They’re risk takers. They’re wired a certain kind of way and they’re going to do it, but you can be an entrepreneur. You can be a different kind of entrepreneur. You can align with someone, but again, don’t think you’re an investor because you go to meetups or because you watch podcasts or whatever the case is. You’re an investor once you stroke a check, once you invest in a thing, you’re an investor, so I encourage people to take action, any action forward progress, and then align with other people that are taking action, align with people that are doing things at a level you want to do them at, right?
You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with. Do you want to be a millionaire? Like hanging out with five of them? You’ll become the sixth. People have heard this, but it’s, it’s just so incredibly true. Anything I’ve achieved in my life anytime. I’ve, upleveled my faith, my fitness, my finances. It’s always been because I sought the circle. I sought to be around people who were doing it at the level I wanted to do it at. And I gravitated up to their level. So, um, I am just, uh, my, my energy, right? Like the energy. I surround myself with the people who I let into my world. Uh, I am unapologetically over-protective of my energy, my space, my time. Uh, I want to be around A-players people that are playing to win. Um, so again, I would say those two things, like take action and get around people that are taking action.
Totally man, that’s awesome, dude. So how do people find you? People want to get into the value ag construction business. I know you have a program around it. So how do people get a hold of you?
Yeah, so everything’s branded under the, uh, my name gabedasilva.com where they can go find out more about me. That’s where, um, my YouTube series is housed in and, um, it’s called The Build, right? So I had a docu-series where I had someone follow me for six months, document the journey so people can see what it’s actually like to do, what we do day in and day out. And that’ll quickly tell you if this is for you or not. Plenty of people watch that and say, I’d rather lend to you than do that. So they can go there. I’ve got my, uh, my eBook is there. There’s plenty of free information there for them. Uh, the education stuff you’re referencing, that’s all done under the fix and flip foundation’s brand, uh, four F’s – find, fund, fix, and flip of value, add rehabbing. Um, again, that’s all available there.
Find me there. Uh, I’m active on social. So, uh, ideally, um, Instagram’s a great place to get me. I respond to everything, I’m still active in my DMS. Like it’s me. So if you message me @realgabedasilva, you’ll get me. Uh, and I’m happy to engage with people. They’re happy to help, you know, whether it’s, um, you know, whether they’re a fit for the course or the mastermind or not. That’s not important. What is is that, uh, I leave them better than I found them. I bring them value in whatever capacity I can serve them. If you’re far enough along in your journey where you’re ready for the next step, of course, we’re ready to help you do that. That’s what we do. But, um, yeah, I would encourage people to just find me there – gabedasilva.com – explore the stuff that I’ve got there. It’s all free content. And then just message me on Instagram. Happy to connect there.
Oh man. Well, thanks for adding value. And you know, I, like I said, we met not too long ago, man. I can tell you’re a good dude to see what kind of synergy we have with our businesses. And, uh, thanks for adding value, man. We’ll uh, we’ll talk to you real soon.
Thanks mate. Thanks for having me here.
Alright, see you man.